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<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006>Dear
all,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006>The Phyloinformatics journal shows how
easy social contracts can fail and formerly trusted archives
just</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006>disappear...</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006>There are some initiatives which aim to provide
standards for the preservation and archiving of digital
contents.</SPAN></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006>For example the OAIS reference model (<A
href="http://public.ccsds.org/publications/archive/650x0b1.pdf">http://public.ccsds.org/publications/archive/650x0b1.pdf</A>)
which aims</SPAN></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006>to become ISO. Or here in germany the the DINI
initiative (<A href="http://www.dini.de/">http://www.dini.de/</A>) and the
NESTOR project</SPAN></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006>(<A
href="http://www.langzeitarchivierung.de/index.php?newlang=eng">http://www.langzeitarchivierung.de/index.php?newlang=eng</A>).</SPAN></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006>Both german initiatives aim to provide certificates for
long term archives, I guess similar to the quality
standard</SPAN></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006>ISO 9001 .</SPAN></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006></SPAN></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006>It would be very interesting to me if you knew similar
initiatives from your countries?</SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006>Today, it is impossible to estimate how good the
ability of a content provider (including taxonomic databases)
</SPAN></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006>for real long term archiving really is . Certificates
could help a lot I think, especially if they would require a
</SPAN></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006>'</SPAN></SPAN></FONT><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN class=159350009-29112006>fall back
strategy' of the candidate archive. Such a strategy could simple be to nominate
a partner archive</SPAN></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006>which would store the content on their servers in case
of emergency (and resolve the LSIDs in our case).</SPAN></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006></SPAN></SPAN></FONT><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006></SPAN></SPAN></FONT><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006></SPAN></SPAN></FONT><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006></SPAN></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006>best regards, Robert</SPAN></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006></SPAN></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006><SPAN
class=159350009-29112006></SPAN></SPAN></FONT><FONT face=Tahoma><FONT
size=2><SPAN class=159350009-29112006> </SPAN>-----Ursprüngliche
Nachricht-----<BR><B>Von:</B> tdwg-guid-bounces@mailman.nhm.ku.edu
[mailto:tdwg-guid-bounces@mailman.nhm.ku.edu]<B>Im Auftrag von </B>P. Bryan
Heidorn<BR><B>Gesendet:</B> Dienstag, 28. November 2006 23:14<BR><B>An:</B>
Richard Pyle<BR><B>Cc:</B> tdwg-guid@mailman.nhm.ku.edu<BR><B>Betreff:</B> Re:
[Tdwg-guid] Demise of Phyloinformatics journal<BR><BR></DIV></FONT></FONT>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">It
is important to inform the Library of Congress and other entities about the
special needs of the taxonomic community so that they can put the appropriate
mechanisms into place. The library community solution including, academic
libraries, LC and its counterparts in other countries do make a fairly
survivable system that might indeed survive some major upheavals. The
biodiversity community need not go it alone. It is better to share the deeper
pockets of nuclear physics, astronomy, and medicine. We have unique needs but
we can rely on subsystems put into place for these other sciences.
<DIV><BR class=khtml-block-placeholder></DIV>
<DIV>Also, currently, going digital does not mean not using paper. For the
near future it would be good to have a few paper copies of important documents
along with the digital copy. Also, if we have digital copy, at any point in
the future, assuming we still have trees to make paper, we can decide
to abandon the digital systems and print out what we want. It is not an
either/or decision not and will not be in the future either.</DIV>
<DIV><BR>
<DIV>
<DIV>On Nov 28, 2006, at 1:40 PM, Richard Pyle wrote:</DIV><BR
class=Apple-interchange-newline>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">I certainly agree with Dave that the technology
exists, and I agree with</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Roger that we seem to be on the right path. My
comment about it being "a</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">much bigger issue than our community is able to
solve" was more along the</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">lines of ensuring persistence for centuries or
millenia.<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>The Library
of</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Congress was appropriated $100 million to deal with
this issue</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">(<A
href="http://www.digitalpreservation.gov/about/index.html">http://www.digitalpreservation.gov/about/index.html</A>),
which is a just a bit</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">more than we have access to. The real problem, of
course, is that because</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">digital media have existed for only a few decades,
we don't have an</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">established track record to say, with adequate
confidence, that we "know"</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">how to preserve digital data for centuries or
millenia (in the way that some</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">paper-based media have survived for such periods of
time).<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>This is why the</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">system along the lines of what we're discussing can
only really be thought</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">of as a "pilot project".</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">The fact of the matter is, we don't really need to
have confidence that our</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">system is good enough to perservere for
centuries.<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>We only have to
be</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">confident that it will perservere until technology
establishes a system that</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">*will* survive for centuries. If we're lucky, that
probably will happen</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">within the next few decades.</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">So...to echo Roger, "the sun is shining and I feel
we are heading in the</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">right direction" -- Rumsfeldisms
notwithstanding.</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Aloha,</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Rich</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Richard L. Pyle, PhD</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Database Coordinator for Natural Sciences</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>and
Associate Zoologist in Ichthyology</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Department of Natural Sciences, Bishop Museum</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">1525 Bernice St., Honolulu, HI 96817</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Ph: (808)848-4115, Fax: (808)847-8252</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">email: <A
href="mailto:deepreef@bishopmuseum.org">deepreef@bishopmuseum.org</A></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><A
href="http://hbs.bishopmuseum.org/staff/pylerichard.html">http://hbs.bishopmuseum.org/staff/pylerichard.html</A></DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">-----Original Message-----</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">From: Dave Vieglais [<A
href="mailto:vieglais@ku.edu">mailto:vieglais@ku.edu</A>]<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Sent: Monday, November 27, 2006 5:08 PM</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">To: Richard Pyle</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Cc: "'\"Döring, Markus\"'"; <A
href="mailto:tdwg-guid@mailman.nhm.ku.edu">tdwg-guid@mailman.nhm.ku.edu</A></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Subject: Re: [Tdwg-guid] Demise of
Phyloinformatics journal</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">I think such a system is quite well within the
grasp of this<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">community- even without any particularly novel
new<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">developments.<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>We have a system for unique IDs
(LSIDs) which<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">can be assigned to each document (actually each
combination<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">of object + metadata).<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>Assuming the documents are
stored in<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">an environment exposed by a protocol such as OAI
(Open<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Archives Initiative), a harvester could easily
retrieve<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">copies of documents (actually any objects with
IDs).</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">There's nothing to stop the harvester cache being
exposed by<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">the same protocol.<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>With a group of these harvester
+ OAI<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">servers, and no limits on subscriptions then each
harvester<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">would have a copy of everything, probably an
undesirable outcome.</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Harvester reach could be restricted by queries
such as "all<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">objects of type document" or "all objects
published before<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">1999" or any other query supported by the
metadata.<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>Or,<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">given the availability of one or more indexers,
which index<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">all the available OAI services, a query such as
"all objects<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">for which there are only 9 copies" could be
executed.<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>The<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">result would be a list of LSIDs that need to be
retrieved by<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">the cache.<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>Of course there will be time
lags between index<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">and harvester states, so there will likely end up
being more<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">than 10 copies of objects per cache, but is that
really a problem?</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">All the pieces necessary for building such a
system already<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">exist in the WASABI framework - LSID assignment,
OAI server,<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">OAI harvester, indexer, cache.</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">The only real modification is to adapt the WASABI
server to<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">store objects along with their metadata, but this
was kind of<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">planned to support media objects.<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>I don't mean to preach<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">WASABIsh here, such a topic has been on my mind
for a while<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">(actually distributed object storage, not just
documents).</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">TAPIR and other protocols would probably work
just fine as<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">well with some modifications.</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">It seems pretty simple, but perhaps I'm missing
some important pieces?</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">cheers,</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><SPAN class=Apple-converted-space>
</SPAN>Dave V.</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Richard Pyle said the following on 28-11-2006
09:05:</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Great article, Markus! Very similar to what I
had in mind. <SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">I've never<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">visited BitTorrent, but I gather that its
structure and<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">function are<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">not altogether different from the original
Napster.<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>Your<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">description<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">of a system that monitors available copies of
any digital<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">document and<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">automatically ensures that a minimum number of
copies are extant is</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">*exactly* what I was thinking.<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>In my view, there
wouldn't<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">be only one<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">"hall monitor" server, but dozens or hundreds
(likely<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">correlated with<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">major institutions or hard-core individuals
with ample<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">available storage space).</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">And I would probably draw the line for minimum
number of copies at<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">closer to 100 or so, and also include
algorithms to ensure they are<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">adequately distributed on geographic scales.
Obviously,<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">GUIDs would be<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">a critical component of such a system.</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">It's a much bigger issue than our community is
able to<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">solve, I think<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">-- but certainly we could implement some pilot
projects along these<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">lines for our own data needs, to see how such a
system<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">might work within our context.</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Aloha,</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Rich</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">-----Original Message-----</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">From: <A
href="mailto:tdwg-guid-bounces@mailman.nhm.ku.edu">tdwg-guid-bounces@mailman.nhm.ku.edu</A></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">[<A
href="mailto:tdwg-guid-bounces@mailman.nhm.ku.edu">mailto:tdwg-guid-bounces@mailman.nhm.ku.edu</A>]
On Behalf Of<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">"Döring,<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Markus"</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Sent: Monday, November 27, 2006 5:56 AM</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">To: <A
href="mailto:tdwg-guid@mailman.nhm.ku.edu">tdwg-guid@mailman.nhm.ku.edu</A></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Subject: Re: [Tdwg-guid] Demise of
Phyloinformatics journal</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Richards post and Napster keyword reminded me
of a vague<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">idea I had<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">for some time to use P2P networks like
bittorrent as an persitent<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">storage space. You can read about it a bit
more closely here:</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><A
href="http://www.pywrapper.com/markus/blog/2006/using-bittorrent-as-">http://www.pywrapper.com/markus/blog/2006/using-bittorrent-as-</A></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">a-persistent-storage-space/</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Don't take it as a real proposal, but I like
the general<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">idea if it.<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">It might even have been done already within
the GRID<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">community. But<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">it conveys the original internet idea of
distributing<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">resources and<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">minimizing impact if a nodes gets lost.</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">A quite nice discussion by the way.</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Markus</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">--</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>Markus Döring</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>Botanic Garden and Botanical
Museum Berlin Dahlem,<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space>
</SPAN>Dept. of<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Biodiversity Informatics<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>Königin-Luise-Str. 6-8,
D-14191 Berlin</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>Phone: +49 30 83850-284</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>Email: <A
href="mailto:m.doering@bgbm.org">m.doering@bgbm.org</A></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>URL: <A
href="http://www.bgbm.org/BioDivInf/">http://www.bgbm.org/BioDivInf/</A></DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">-----Original Message-----</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">From: <A
href="mailto:tdwg-guid-bounces@mailman.nhm.ku.edu">tdwg-guid-bounces@mailman.nhm.ku.edu</A></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">[<A
href="mailto:tdwg-guid-bounces@mailman.nhm.ku.edu">mailto:tdwg-guid-bounces@mailman.nhm.ku.edu</A>]
On Behalf<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Of Richard<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Pyle</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Sent: Sonntag, 26. November 2006
20:42</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">To: 'P. Bryan Heidorn'; <A
href="mailto:tdwg-guid@mailman.nhm.ku.edu">tdwg-guid@mailman.nhm.ku.edu</A>;
'Taxacom'</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Subject: Re: [Tdwg-guid] Demise of
Phyloinformatics journal</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">I only just now read Bryan Heidorn's
excellent post on this topic<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">(below). One thing I would add is that the
nature of the</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">internet and</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">electronic information allow us
opportunities to ensure</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">permanence and</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">access that were either impossible, or
prohibitively</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">expensive even a</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">decade ago.<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>Imagine, for example, an
internet protocol</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">that allowed</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">both institutions and individuals to "plug
in" and expose their<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">digitial catalogs of stored electronic
publications (and other</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">resources) such that the whereabouts of
literally thousands</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">of copies</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">of every electronic publication could be
known to anyone.<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">The system I</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">envision is somewhat of a cross between
existing protocols for<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">interlibrary loan, and the original
Napster.<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>Certainly
all</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">sorts of</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">copyright issues need to be sorted out, but
these are short-term<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">problems (less than a century), compared to
the long-term</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">(multi-millenia?) issue of information
persistence. The point is,<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">knowing the whereabaouts of extant copies
of digital documents,<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">coupled with the amazing ease and low cost
of duplication</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">and global</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">dissemination (not to mention plummeting
costs of</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">electronic storage</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">media), would virtually guarantee the
long-term persistence</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">of digital</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">information.</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Any system is, of course, vulnerable to the
collapse (or major</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">perturbation) of human civilization.<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>And the electronic<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">translator<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">problem I alluded to in an earlier post
cannot be<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">ignored.<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space>
</SPAN>But to<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">pretend that the potential doesn't exist or
shouldn't be actively<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">pursued is pure folly, in my opinion.</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Aloha,</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Rich</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Richard L. Pyle, PhD</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Database Coordinator for Natural
Sciences</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><SPAN class=Apple-converted-space>
</SPAN>and Associate Zoologist in Ichthyology Department of
Natural<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Sciences, Bishop Museum</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">1525 Bernice St., Honolulu, HI 96817</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Ph: (808)848-4115, Fax: (808)847-8252</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">email: <A
href="mailto:deepreef@bishopmuseum.org">deepreef@bishopmuseum.org</A></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><A
href="http://hbs.bishopmuseum.org/staff/pylerichard.html">http://hbs.bishopmuseum.org/staff/pylerichard.html</A></DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">-----Original Message-----</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">From: <A
href="mailto:tdwg-guid-bounces@mailman.nhm.ku.edu">tdwg-guid-bounces@mailman.nhm.ku.edu</A></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">[<A
href="mailto:tdwg-guid-bounces@mailman.nhm.ku.edu">mailto:tdwg-guid-bounces@mailman.nhm.ku.edu</A>]
On Behalf Of P.<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Bryan Heidorn</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Sent: Friday, November 24, 2006 8:22
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">To: <A
href="mailto:tdwg-guid@mailman.nhm.ku.edu">tdwg-guid@mailman.nhm.ku.edu</A>;
Taxacom</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Subject: Re: [Tdwg-guid] Demise of
Phyloinformatics journal</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">The problem and solution has less to do
with the Internet</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">and more</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">to do with institutional longevity.</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">The permanence of paper has less to do
with acid free</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">paper and more</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">to do with the relative permanence of the
institutions<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">that house<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">them. Most paper documents over a hundred
years old have</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">been lost</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">forever because there were no permanent
institutions to<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">hold them<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">until the advent of public and academic
libraries. Papers in<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">individual scientists collections are
discarded when they</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">die. War</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">and economic upheavals left paper in rain
and fire. It is</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">foolhardy</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">to assume that what is on paper is
safe.</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">We know that dissemination of information
in electronic</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">form is must</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">more economical than paper dissemination.
The issue is</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">development</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">of proper institutions with adequate
stable funding to</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">develop and</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">maintain copies into "perpetuity".</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Commercial publishers, are clearly not
the answer for</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">preservation.<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Corporations and publishers go out of
business all the</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">time. It is</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">only because libraries kept paper copies
that we still have a<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">record.</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Digital preservation and access problems
exist for all</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">sciences and</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">government documents so there is no need
to the biodiversity<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">community to go it alone on this. We are
just in the<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">beginning of<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">the digital publishing history and have
not yet</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">established adequate</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">preservation mechanisms within libraries
to handle data<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">curation,<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">preservation and access in all the
situations where it is</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">necessary.</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">There are projects underway world wide to
address this issue.<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">In the United States the Library of
Congress The<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">National Digital<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Information Infrastructure and
Preservation Program http://<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">www.digitalpreservation.gov/ is one
example. The U.S.</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Government agency the Institute of Museum
and Library Services</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">(IMLS) http:// <A
href="http://www.imls.gov">www.imls.gov</A>/ began grant programs
to train<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">librarians and museum curators in digital
librarianship and most<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">recently in digital data curation<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><A
href="http://www.imls.gov/applicants/grants/">http://www.imls.gov/applicants/grants/</A></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">21centuryLibrarian.shtm is addressing the
education issues.<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">The University of North
Carolina</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><A
href="http://www.ils.unc.edu/digccurr2007/">http://www.ils.unc.edu/digccurr2007/</A></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">papers.html and the University of
Illinois</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><A
href="http://sci.lis.uiuc.edu">http://sci.lis.uiuc.edu</A>/</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">DCEP/ have begun working on best
practices and education.<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">This week</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">say the successful Data Curation
Conference (DCC) in Glasgow,<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Scotland <A
href="http://www.dcc.ac.uk/events/dcc-2006/">http://www.dcc.ac.uk/events/dcc-2006/</A>.
DCC will</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">be running</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">"Long-term Curation and Preservation of
Journals"</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">31 January 2007. (as an aside, at DCC
conference I saw</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">results of a</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">survey in "Attitudes and aspirations in a
diverse world:<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">the Project</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">StORe perspective on scientific
repositories" Graham Pryor,<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">University of Edinburgh <A
href="http://www.dcc.ac.uk/events/dcc-2006/">http://www.dcc.ac.uk/events/dcc-2006/</A></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">programme/presentations/g-pryor.ppt that
more scientists trusted<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">publishers to save their digital
documents than their home<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">institutions and libraries! It is clear
that scientists are<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">generally not trained in economics and
that the information<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">technology management of many
institutions must be abysmal!</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">We need something like to 5 institution
rule for distribution to<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">apply for digital documents. Digital
documents need to be</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">replicated</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">as well for both access and
preservation.</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Institutions like the Internet Archive
help with some of</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">the current</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">problems.</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Institutional Repositories (IR) are
another. Many</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">universities and</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">libraries world wide are beginning these.
It is authors'</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">responsibility<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>to deposit their
publications in these</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">institutions</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">and to support their creation. JSTOR and
other institutions also<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">exist. They all have their weaknesses and
additional research,<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">development and funding is needed to
adequately address</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">the issues.</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Also, all journals need to be managed
using good data curation<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">principles but al too often the
publishers in spite of best<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">intentions are not educated in such
issues.</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Digital publishing of taxonomic
literature are not the</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">full answer</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">for current poor dissemination of
taxonomic literature.<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">The deposit</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">of a published name in five institutions
is a</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">preservation rule, not</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">a dissemination rule.<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>We hurt science and
human health</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">is we do not</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">at the same time address the information
access issue. <SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">We need to</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">aspire to better dissemination and
preservation. Electronic<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">publishing will help but only if
appropriate institutions</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">in place.</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">On the smaller issue, DOIs for
publications, electronic</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">or paper is</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">a no-brainer. URLs were never designed to
be permanent.<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">URLs were<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">designed to be reused and be
flexible.</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">With DOIs we can place the same paper in
multiple digital or<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">physical locations and reliably find
copies.</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Bryan Heidorn</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">--</DIV>
<DIV
style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV
style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV
style="MARGIN: 0px">--------------------------------------------------------------------</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>P. Bryan
Heidorn<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space>
</SPAN>Graduate School of Library and<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Information</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Science</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN><A
href="mailto:pheidorn@uiuc.edu">pheidorn@uiuc.edu</A> <SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>University of Illinois
at<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Urbana-Champaign MC-493</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>(V)217/
244-7792<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>501
East Daniel St., Champaign, IL <SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">61820-6212</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN>(F)217/
244-3302<SPAN class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN><A
href="https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/pheidorn/www">https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/pheidorn/www</A></DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">On Nov 24, 2006, at 9:54 AM, Renato De
Giovanni wrote:</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Rod,</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Thanks for sharing with us the
information. I already</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">imagined that</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">things like that could happen, but it's
always better to</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">argue having</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">real examples.</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Anyway, just in case someone reading
the story decides to</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">blame URLs,</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">I just wanted to say that in my opinion
the main issue</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">here is not</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">the technology or the GUID format being
used. It's the</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">business model</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">and the management strategy.</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">I can easily imagine similar things
happening to DOIs,</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">LSIDs or other</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">kinds of issued GUIDs if the
institution(s) behind them simply<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">disappear.</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Best Regards,</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Renato</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">--</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">IT Researcher</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">CRIA - Reference Center on
Environmental Information<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px"><A
href="http://www.cria.org.br">http://www.cria.org.br</A>/</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">On 24 Nov 2006 at 13:37, Roderic Page
wrote:</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">The Open Access web-only journal
"Phyloinformatics"<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">seems to have</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">disappeared, with the Internet
address http://<SPAN
class=Apple-converted-space> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">www.phyloinformatics.org now up for
sale. This means the</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">articles</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">have just disappeared!</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">There weren't many papers published,
but some were</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">interesting and</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">have</DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">been cited in the mainstream
literature.</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">This also illustrates the problems
with linking to digital</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">resources</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">using URLs, as opposed to identifiers
such as DOIs. With</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">the loss of</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">the domain name, this journal has
effectively died.</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">A sobering lesson...</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Regards</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
<DIV style="MARGIN: 0px">Rod</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV>
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style="MARGIN: 0px">_______________________________________________</DIV>
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g-guid</DIV>
<DIV style="MIN-HEIGHT: 14px; MARGIN: 0px"><BR></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
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<DIV style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px">--------------------------------------------------------------------</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"> P. Bryan Heidorn Graduate School
of Library and Information Science</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"> <A
href="mailto:pheidorn@uiuc.edu">pheidorn@uiuc.edu</A> University of
Illinois at Urbana-Champaign MC-493</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"> (V)217/ 244-7792 501 East Daniel
St., Champaign, IL 61820-6212</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"> (F)217/ 244-3302 </SPAN><FONT
class=Apple-style-span size=4><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 14px"><A
href="https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/pheidorn/www">https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/pheidorn/www</A></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"> Online Calendar: <A
href="http://tinyurl.com/6fd5q">http://tinyurl.com/6fd5q</A></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px"> Visit the Biobrowser Web site at <A
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